I have a fantasy in which I’m allowed to conduct a nationwide experiment lasting several years. It would work like this: First, I get to select a harmless food I don’t like very much and wouldn’t mind giving up. I think I’ll go with celery.
Then, working in cahoots with several prominent health organizations, I get to convince the American public that my selected food causes premature death. Given the current state of nutrition and health journalism, this wouldn’t be a difficult task. We could just trumpet a few studies showing that 75% of all heart attack victims consumed celery in the previous year, for example. Eventually the media would be full of headlines warning people to cut celery from their diets. TIME magazine would run a major article titled Sorry, It’s True … Celery Is A Killer. (Subtitle: party trays will never be the same.)
Now for the really fun part … a dozen years or so later, I would conduct a large epidemiological study comparing celery consumption with death rates. And I can already guarantee the result: people who eat a lot of celery tend to die younger. This would, of course, prove that celery is a health hazard, right?
Of course not. All it would prove is that health-conscious people had heeded the warnings and were dutifully avoiding celery. Or, to look at it another way, it would prove that people who choose to ignore the dire warnings about celery are what doctors call non-adherers … or what I call people who don’t give a @#$%. It would prove absolutely nothing about the actual health effects of celery.
But that’s not how most of the public or (sadly) most health professionals would see it. The health professionals would avoid the stuff and counsel their patients to do likewise, citing my study as proof. CSPI would blitz the media with press releases warning about the high celery content of take-out Chinese food. (A heart attack in box!) Joy Bauer would demonstrate how to use carrots instead of celery to scoop up fat-free ranch dressing.
Finally, for the big punchline, I’d get to announce that the whole thing was a joke, preferably on national TV. “Fooled ya, folks! There is not and never has been anything dangerous about eating celery. Ha-ha!”
But by then, no one would believe me. I’d be accused of being a flack for Big Celery. I don’t care … I don’t like celery anyway.
Okay, that’s my fantasy. (And yes, you are allowed to make wisecracks at this point … something about the wild fantasies of a 51-year-old computer geek should do the trick.) Now here’s why I thought of it again today:
Some of you are familiar with Jason Sandeman, the Well Done Chef, because he’s written a couple of guests posts to share his recipes. Jason was recently diagnosed as a diabetic — first as a Type 2, but then as a Type 1. Over the weekend, I asked how he’s adjusting. He replied today:
I have impressed the doctors and the nurses with how fast I have gained control, mainly by ignoring their advice. I am sure it is well intentioned, but misguided … I was directed to this study by a “helpful” diabetes nurse.
The study the nurse wanted Jason to read (actually, she wanted him to read an article summarizing it) is one that came out a couple of years ago and was reported all over the media with headlines such as Seven or more eggs a week raises risk of death. Several bloggers with functioning brains took it apart at the time (I wasn’t blogging yet), but it’s worth another look, if only because it’s a perfect example of how demonizing a food can lead to exactly the kind of associations my anti-celery campaign would produce.
The Harvard team studied 21,327 men taking part in the much larger Physicians’ Health Study, which has been watching doctors since 1981 who have agreed to report regularly on their health and lifestyle habits. Over 20 years, 1,550 of the men had heart attacks, 1,342 had strokes, and more than 5,000 died.
“Egg consumption was not associated with (heart attack) or stroke,” the researchers wrote. But the men who ate seven eggs a week or more were 23 percent more likely to have died during the 20-year period. Diabetic men who ate any eggs at all were twice as likely to die in the 20 years.
Okay, this study already has problems. Why were we all told to avoid eggs? Because they’ll give you heart disease, by gosh! And yet the authors noted that egg consumption was not associated with heart disease — just with premature death in general. Hmmm … so how exactly are the eggs killing all those doctors? Are the doctors spilling eggs on the floor, then slipping on them?
I looked up the full study and found other problems as well. The egg-consumption figures were compiled from food questionnaires mailed at various intervals over the course of the study: baseline, 24, 48, 72, 96, and 120 months. Those questionnaires are notoriously inaccurate.
But let’s suppose the doctors reported their egg consumption accurately. Doctors are, after all, more likely than most folks to think carefully about their diets … which leads to another flaw in the study: the participants are doctors. Most of this study took place after 1984, which is when TIME magazine scared the bejesus out everyone about cholesterol and doctors started telling their patients to cut back on cholesterol and fat. So we’re looking at a population that’s probably a bit egg-phobic to begin with. An editorial in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition that accompanied the study pretty much says exactly that:
The egg intake pattern in this study population was extremely low: only 8% of participants were eating >= 1 egg/d. For comparison, 36% of the men in the Framingham study and 37% of men in a Japanese study with similar outcome assessments ate >=1 egg/d.
No surprise there: doctors are far less likely than the rest of us to eat at least one egg per day. That’s what they’ve been taught. In fact, in the full text of the study, the authors stated that the median consumption of eggs among the doctors was one per week.
So … what kind of doctor ignores the advice — which has been shouted from the medical rooftops since at least 1984 — to cut back on eating eggs? I can think of two kinds:
- The very few doctors who know cholesterol-rich foods aren’t dangerous (Eades, Vernon, Sears, Ravnskov, etc.).
- Doctors who don’t give a @#$%.
And wouldn’t you know it, that’s exactly what the study would suggest:
Men who ate the most eggs also were older, fatter, ate more vegetables but less breakfast cereal, and were more likely to drink alcohol, smoke and less likely to exercise — all factors that can affect the risk of heart attack and death.
Although the study didn’t mention it, I’ll bet you dollars to donuts the egg-eating doctors were also more likely to eat donuts and drink sodas. I don’t know many people who drink, smoke, and avoid exercise but then avoid sugar because it isn’t good for them.
The “helpful” nurse no doubt wanted Jason to read the article because of this finding:
Among male physicians with diabetes, any egg consumption is associated with a greater risk of all-cause mortality.
The editorial states that most of the diabetic doctors were probably Type 2 diabetics. So, once again, what kind of doctor is more likely to develop Type 2 diabetes? A doctor who eats a lot of sugar and starch. And since diabetics are counseled to go on very low-fat diets, which kind of diabetic doctor is more likely to eat eggs? A diabetic doctor who doesn’t give a @#$% … which means a diabetic doctor who is more likely to smoke, drink, avoid exercise, and be overweight.
To be fair to the researchers, they cited other studies that found zero association between egg consumption and premature death, and also mentioned the limitations of their own study. Here’s an example:
The fact that our sample consists of male physicians who may have different behaviors than the general population limits the generalizability of our findings.
Our study has additional limitations. We cannot exclude unmeasured confounding or residual confounding as possible explanation of the observed positive association among diabetic subjects. In particular, we were not able to examine the effects of saturated fat, markers of insulin resistance, lipids, and other nutrients or relevant biomarkers on the observed association. While in our study, the lack of detailed dietary questionnaire prevent us from controlling for energy and other major nutrients, this was not the case in the Nurses’ Health Study and the Health Professionals’ Follow-up Study, where total energy intake was accounted for.
In other words: We found an association — period. We can’t actually explain it, because there were too many unmeasured or uncontrolled variables. And by the way, several other studies found no such association. If you read the whole study, that’s the takeaway message. But take another look at the headline and lead paragraph when the study was reported in the media:
Seven or more eggs a week raises risk of death
Men with diabetes who ate any eggs at all raised their risk of death during a 20-year period studied, according to the study published in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition.
Doesn’t using the transitive verb “raise” make it sound just a wee bit like cause and effect? You know, like a Boy Scout raising the flag? Doing it on purpose and all that?
That’s the sorry state of health and nutrition reporting. Which means my celery experiment would be a fabulous success … well, for everyone except the Chinese restaurants and the celery-farmers.
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Celery. Deadly Stalker. Etc.
There would probably have to be some kind of comparative Japanese study attempted, if only to justify a pun on salaryman.
LOL.
I think, given the current public opinion and the varying opinions among experts, that it’s actually possible to shift the general perception of eggs in the next years. Many mainstream nutritionists already see through the myth. There is not even the A causes B, B causes C argument to back anything up when it comes to eggs. Additionally, eggs are 30% saturated fat and 70% “healthy” fat so pointing that out along with the fact that dietary cholesterol has almost no association with serum cholesterol levels is usually enough to convince average people in a matter of minutes.
However, the saturated fat-cholesterol-heart disease link is probably the biggest brainwash of the last decades and will be harder to deal with. The average person brainwashed by public health advocates, food marketers (80% less saturated fat!!), the entertainment industry (it seems like every other American movie has some reference to the hypothesis – “hold the bacon/meatloaf/cheeseburger Al, your doctor said so”) will never believe an elevator pitch about the biggest scam in the history of science, held afloat in a positive feedback loop by organizations who base their reputation on it, grain producers and vegetarians. It almost sounds like a conspiracy theory to those not open to it.
My point is that by shifting the outward focus to acquitting eggs, that kind of opinion change would fuel the more necessary shift.
Besides, loving your last few posts. Keep it up!
That’s the biggest obstacle indeed, the “artery-clogging saturated fat!” myth. I see it over and over.
It would be funny if it wasn’t happening to us… Well at least the future generations will have a good laugh.
Oh, I suspect 100 years from now, they’ll wonder how we could’ve been so stupid as to avoid natural fats. At least I hope that’s the case. Heaven forbid they still believe the Lipid Hypothesis.
Did you know the reason “bacon kills” is because of the celery used to cure bacon in place of artificial nitrates? The fat is good for you… turns out it was the celery all along!
(I hate celery)
I knew it was the celery all along.
2,4, 6, 8– now is time to celeribrate!
LOL! I was thinking about establishing celery as an unhealthy food-item, too. Hate that stuff. I’ve heard recently that if you take broccoli and hack it in pieces and then try to sprinkle it over rest of your broccoli field, you would not be allowed to do it. Broccoli contains more pesticides naturally than can be legally sprayed on them. 😀
The same is true for soy, by the way. So … eat your vegetables … (?)
So it’s broccoli that kills. Now I’m in trouble; I like broccoli.
Celery. Deadly Stalker. Etc.
There would probably have to be some kind of comparative Japanese study attempted, if only to justify a pun on salaryman.
LOL.
I think, given the current public opinion and the varying opinions among experts, that it’s actually possible to shift the general perception of eggs in the next years. Many mainstream nutritionists already see through the myth. There is not even the A causes B, B causes C argument to back anything up when it comes to eggs. Additionally, eggs are 30% saturated fat and 70% “healthy” fat so pointing that out along with the fact that dietary cholesterol has almost no association with serum cholesterol levels is usually enough to convince average people in a matter of minutes.
However, the saturated fat-cholesterol-heart disease link is probably the biggest brainwash of the last decades and will be harder to deal with. The average person brainwashed by public health advocates, food marketers (80% less saturated fat!!), the entertainment industry (it seems like every other American movie has some reference to the hypothesis – “hold the bacon/meatloaf/cheeseburger Al, your doctor said so”) will never believe an elevator pitch about the biggest scam in the history of science, held afloat in a positive feedback loop by organizations who base their reputation on it, grain producers and vegetarians. It almost sounds like a conspiracy theory to those not open to it.
My point is that by shifting the outward focus to acquitting eggs, that kind of opinion change would fuel the more necessary shift.
Besides, loving your last few posts. Keep it up!
That’s the biggest obstacle indeed, the “artery-clogging saturated fat!” myth. I see it over and over.
Even though that study is flawed on so many levels and is just a complete uncontrolled survey with very little conclusive information its probably the type of survey the government must invest most of their cash in.
Vague and absolutely useless statistical data like this would government the weapon it needs to continue waging their war against saturated fat and keep the people (and doctors) under the illusion that they have maintained since 1984. I mean who is gonna question a statistical survey that basically states an hypothesis as a conclusion. Instead of saying ‘we conducted an uncontrolled statistical analysis to see the effects of eggs on their health, they basically say “Seven or more eggs a week raises risk of death” as a title. Also the fact that they use doctors diet info makes it even worse since it just makes people believe if so many doctors(who are deities in most people’s mind) can’t handle eggs then maybe we normal people should stay away from it!!!
Thanks for the reminder … I forgot to mention the part of my fantasy where I receive generous funding from Uncle Sam to conduct my study.
This is almost a complete aside, but somewhere, Eades I think, I read that fiber and vegetables can be very irritating and bad for the human digestive tract. BT (before Taubes), I used to call veggies broom food. I had thought that was a good thing, but now I’m pretty sure it’s a negative. And your post about flour actually being the culprit that could clog a sink drain, but fat instead ‘greases the skids’, turned another idea I had had right up on its head! I thank you for that
Back to the celery. We harbor 1000 trillion friendly, commensal bacteria that we provide all the supplies and food for- and you thought feeding your children was time consuming. Vegetables and starch affect them, but what do they care if their ignorant host eats low-fat, low-calorie, starchy food. They can adapt to anything and will keep calling for anything, if you let them control the show. Peter over at Hyperlipid wrote a post about the demonstrated effect these little buggers have on our hunger centers and feeding behavior. This aside is getting into Twilight Zone sounding territory, but it is ignored at our peril. I’m a dyed in the wool scientist but I sometimes find that upon further investigation of ‘out there’ concepts a pearl of HIGHLY useful information. Some things you just cannot make up and fact is stranger than fiction!
I believe Peter proposed they’ve colonized us … pun intended.
Start stocking up on salt, too. I just heard a news report on the radio that the FDA is about to force food makers to cut sodium in our food. After all, everyone knows that “Americans eat too much salt, which leads to high blood pressure and heart disease.”
They’ll cut it from the food, we’ll add it back in with the salt shaker.
It would be funny if it wasn’t happening to us… Well at least the future generations will have a good laugh.
Oh, I suspect 100 years from now, they’ll wonder how we could’ve been so stupid as to avoid natural fats. At least I hope that’s the case. Heaven forbid they still believe the Lipid Hypothesis.
Did you know the reason “bacon kills” is because of the celery used to cure bacon in place of artificial nitrates? The fat is good for you… turns out it was the celery all along!
(I hate celery)
I knew it was the celery all along.
2,4, 6, 8– now is time to celeribrate!
Sounds a lot like the famous second hand smoke study. Bait and switch health. Giant headlines about how deadly it was then a report that said, well maybe but we can’t really prove it.
Penn & Teller did an episode of Bull@#$% on those second-hand smoke studies. Worth watching.
LOL! I was thinking about establishing celery as an unhealthy food-item, too. Hate that stuff. I’ve heard recently that if you take broccoli and hack it in pieces and then try to sprinkle it over rest of your broccoli field, you would not be allowed to do it. Broccoli contains more pesticides naturally than can be legally sprayed on them. 😀
The same is true for soy, by the way. So … eat your vegetables … (?)
So it’s broccoli that kills. Now I’m in trouble; I like broccoli.
Well, of course once you’d published your study, they’d find a group of people somewhere that eat nothing but celery (but drink a lot of cheap moonshine) and live to be 100 years old on average, and we’d have the “celery paradox.”
I spent 15 minutes this morning driving my husband crazy while I gnashed my teeth at a report I saw on Good Morning, America about how some “heath agency” is pushing for legislation that will force manufacturers of processed foods to cut the amount of sodium they use. Then I came to work and saw this:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100420/ap_on_go_ot/us_school_lunches_threat
My brain is going to explode one day, I kid you not.
Yup, the current crowd of busy-bodies in power has all kinds of plans for making us healthier.
I love how it’s gotten to the point where studies claiming saturated fat and cholesterol are evil can even acknowledge that they prove absolutely nothing and still make media headlines.
What’s next, “Bacon raises risk of death in men who mainline heroin”? Of course to prove the study is accurate they would have to inject bacon fat directly into the brains of rabbits while kicking them repeatedly in the face. (If there’s one thing I’ve learned from health studies it’s that killing animals in bizarre and unnatural ways tells us a lot about human health. Just ask T. Colin Campbell.)
For the headlines to be less dramatic, the journalists would have to read entire studies instead of just the conclusions … and they’d have to be more interested in accuracy than in dramatic headlines.
Tom,
On the salt issue…..I wish it were as simple as us just using the salt shaker. But think about it. When the lipophobes fought against coconut oil and lard, we got transfats. They’ll have to come up with something to replace the salt so people will eat it. Probably some knew chemically-altered feaux seasoning that will make us really sick.
Good point … not to mention they have no idea what cutting back on salt will do to people. Another giant, uncontrolled experiment.
Even though that study is flawed on so many levels and is just a complete uncontrolled survey with very little conclusive information its probably the type of survey the government must invest most of their cash in.
Vague and absolutely useless statistical data like this would government the weapon it needs to continue waging their war against saturated fat and keep the people (and doctors) under the illusion that they have maintained since 1984. I mean who is gonna question a statistical survey that basically states an hypothesis as a conclusion. Instead of saying ‘we conducted an uncontrolled statistical analysis to see the effects of eggs on their health, they basically say “Seven or more eggs a week raises risk of death” as a title. Also the fact that they use doctors diet info makes it even worse since it just makes people believe if so many doctors(who are deities in most people’s mind) can’t handle eggs then maybe we normal people should stay away from it!!!
Thanks for the reminder … I forgot to mention the part of my fantasy where I receive generous funding from Uncle Sam to conduct my study.
This is almost a complete aside, but somewhere, Eades I think, I read that fiber and vegetables can be very irritating and bad for the human digestive tract. BT (before Taubes), I used to call veggies broom food. I had thought that was a good thing, but now I’m pretty sure it’s a negative. And your post about flour actually being the culprit that could clog a sink drain, but fat instead ‘greases the skids’, turned another idea I had had right up on its head! I thank you for that
Back to the celery. We harbor 1000 trillion friendly, commensal bacteria that we provide all the supplies and food for- and you thought feeding your children was time consuming. Vegetables and starch affect them, but what do they care if their ignorant host eats low-fat, low-calorie, starchy food. They can adapt to anything and will keep calling for anything, if you let them control the show. Peter over at Hyperlipid wrote a post about the demonstrated effect these little buggers have on our hunger centers and feeding behavior. This aside is getting into Twilight Zone sounding territory, but it is ignored at our peril. I’m a dyed in the wool scientist but I sometimes find that upon further investigation of ‘out there’ concepts a pearl of HIGHLY useful information. Some things you just cannot make up and fact is stranger than fiction!
I believe Peter proposed they’ve colonized us … pun intended.
Start stocking up on salt, too. I just heard a news report on the radio that the FDA is about to force food makers to cut sodium in our food. After all, everyone knows that “Americans eat too much salt, which leads to high blood pressure and heart disease.”
They’ll cut it from the food, we’ll add it back in with the salt shaker.
Sounds a lot like the famous second hand smoke study. Bait and switch health. Giant headlines about how deadly it was then a report that said, well maybe but we can’t really prove it.
Penn & Teller did an episode of Bull@#$% on those second-hand smoke studies. Worth watching.
Well, of course once you’d published your study, they’d find a group of people somewhere that eat nothing but celery (but drink a lot of cheap moonshine) and live to be 100 years old on average, and we’d have the “celery paradox.”
I spent 15 minutes this morning driving my husband crazy while I gnashed my teeth at a report I saw on Good Morning, America about how some “heath agency” is pushing for legislation that will force manufacturers of processed foods to cut the amount of sodium they use. Then I came to work and saw this:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100420/ap_on_go_ot/us_school_lunches_threat
My brain is going to explode one day, I kid you not.
Yup, the current crowd of busy-bodies in power has all kinds of plans for making us healthier.
On the salt issue, I agree with Randy. Look at a can of V8, and then look at a can of low-sodium V8. You’ll see exactly what manufacturers will do: add MSG. Sugar is another alternative, or a fake salt like potassium salt substitute. No way are they going to allow their food to be bland. I cannot understand how people in government don’t see this. They have no problem with food additives, but a problem with salt? How about before we deal with salt, we deal with MSG, coloring, flavorings and a whole lot of other things that obviously are far more dangerous. Some days I think my head will spin off as I read these headlines!
I guess on a positive note, it will give us yet another reason to avoid processed foods.
I love how it’s gotten to the point where studies claiming saturated fat and cholesterol are evil can even acknowledge that they prove absolutely nothing and still make media headlines.
What’s next, “Bacon raises risk of death in men who mainline heroin”? Of course to prove the study is accurate they would have to inject bacon fat directly into the brains of rabbits while kicking them repeatedly in the face. (If there’s one thing I’ve learned from health studies it’s that killing animals in bizarre and unnatural ways tells us a lot about human health. Just ask T. Colin Campbell.)
For the headlines to be less dramatic, the journalists would have to read entire studies instead of just the conclusions … and they’d have to be more interested in accuracy than in dramatic headlines.
Tom,
On the salt issue…..I wish it were as simple as us just using the salt shaker. But think about it. When the lipophobes fought against coconut oil and lard, we got transfats. They’ll have to come up with something to replace the salt so people will eat it. Probably some knew chemically-altered feaux seasoning that will make us really sick.
Good point … not to mention they have no idea what cutting back on salt will do to people. Another giant, uncontrolled experiment.
mmmm
I don’t even read the mainstream health articles anymore. They don’t offer anyone any health advice that’s going to look at them as an individual and see what’s wrong with them.
I mean the possibilities of why some people are fat are many, so to think it could be an egg, or in your fantasy a celery stick, is ridiculous.
For many people who tell me nothing works not even low carb I’ve been doing lots of research on what diet soda does and have come across some interesting stuff about parasites in digestion and I suspect science would be wise to start looking at this in links to many diseases as well!
Poor saturated fat and cholesterol need to stop getting the blame!
@Laurie: That was Dr. Eades on fiber: http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/fiber/a-cautionary-tale-of-mucus-fore-and-aft/. People look at me funny when I tell them I think fiber is about as healthy as cigarettes.
Seven eggs a week? Jiminy, I often eat seven eggs a day. I should be dead before the year is out.
I like the line about how eating “more vegetables but less breakfast cereal” increases risk of “heart attack and death” (actually the quote said “affects” not “increases”, but that seems to be the implication). Gotta love a world where “experts” can come to that sort of conclusion.
Yes, it was quite a study. We learned that eating eggs has no association with heart disease but vegetables will kill you. I wish they’d teased out the celery data.
On the salt issue, I agree with Randy. Look at a can of V8, and then look at a can of low-sodium V8. You’ll see exactly what manufacturers will do: add MSG. Sugar is another alternative, or a fake salt like potassium salt substitute. No way are they going to allow their food to be bland. I cannot understand how people in government don’t see this. They have no problem with food additives, but a problem with salt? How about before we deal with salt, we deal with MSG, coloring, flavorings and a whole lot of other things that obviously are far more dangerous. Some days I think my head will spin off as I read these headlines!
I guess on a positive note, it will give us yet another reason to avoid processed foods.
I eat at least three eggs a day. Cholesterol (HDL and LDL are within normal limits. My triglycerides were a bit high, due to uncontrolled diabetes.
The doctor mentioned the possibility of statins, and counseled me for the low cholesterol low fat diet.
The best part? 1 slice of bread = 3 sugar cubes. Talk about abstract. No thank you. I prefer to keep my dose low, and give my pancreas a rest.
The main problem about fiber is what type it is. If it is a starch, it will raise my blood sugar, which in the long run will do a ton of damage, not to mention impair my ability to make insulin. Then I guess I will need more insulin, and the cycle will continue.
For me, a smile and nod, swallow the usual “advice”, and continue to do what I do best. I eat to my meter. I can almost tell right now what an item will do to me right after eating. That level of control is the best.
Celery? Careful Tom, those celery farmers are a rowdy lot, you don’t want to get on the bad side of them. I ask you to be careful, because noone should be forcefed ants on a log!
If I’m found dead with a mouthful of celery stalks, you know what happened. Be well, Jason, and keep me posted on your progress.
mmmm
I don’t even read the mainstream health articles anymore. They don’t offer anyone any health advice that’s going to look at them as an individual and see what’s wrong with them.
I mean the possibilities of why some people are fat are many, so to think it could be an egg, or in your fantasy a celery stick, is ridiculous.
For many people who tell me nothing works not even low carb I’ve been doing lots of research on what diet soda does and have come across some interesting stuff about parasites in digestion and I suspect science would be wise to start looking at this in links to many diseases as well!
Poor saturated fat and cholesterol need to stop getting the blame!
@Laurie: That was Dr. Eades on fiber: http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/fiber/a-cautionary-tale-of-mucus-fore-and-aft/. People look at me funny when I tell them I think fiber is about as healthy as cigarettes.
Seven eggs a week? Jiminy, I often eat seven eggs a day. I should be dead before the year is out.
I like the line about how eating “more vegetables but less breakfast cereal” increases risk of “heart attack and death” (actually the quote said “affects” not “increases”, but that seems to be the implication). Gotta love a world where “experts” can come to that sort of conclusion.
Yes, it was quite a study. We learned that eating eggs has no association with heart disease but vegetables will kill you. I wish they’d teased out the celery data.
Hope you’ve heard the good news! Subway is now offering breakfast. As if they haven’t done enough damage, now they’re offering low-fat egg-white muffins. http://www.subwayfreshbuzz.com/menu/breakfast/index.asp
Yup, I saw that. I’ll go to McDonald’s for Sausage McMuffins and toss the muffins.
Congress must Do Something about eggs! Those evil, evil eggs contain trace amounts of nearly every vitamin and mineral the human body needs. We can’t let people go around eating them willy nilly though, they have cholesterol in them. Oh the humanity!
Best not give this Congress any ideas …
Ha, brilliant.
My theory is that every type of food is bad for you in some context. It’s just a matter of finding the ones that we get enough benefit from to make it worthwhile. (I’d put eggs and celery high on that list.) We humans just don’t seem to understand this paradox, even though it runs through a lot of different parts of our life. As a (gruesome) example, males who are castrated live longer than other men… even though it’s obviously not a great overall longevity strategy. I see the anti-(insert any food here that people have been eating for longer than 10,000 years) movement as being like someone promoting castration as a great way to live longer. Maybe a great idea if you have tunnel vision, but pretty worthless when you look at the big picture.
What about men who are just natural wimps? Do they live longer?
I saw a story on MSNBC about the new JAMA-published report linking sugar consumption to heart disease. Of course, the reporter had to talk about how we’ve “known for forty years that fat causes heart disease,” and now sugar is a culprit…but not the sugar in fruit, just added table sugar! So, just leave the syrup off your pancakes, I guess, and load up on the hash browns?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/36675974#36675974
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. So now they admit sugar lowers HDL and raises triglycerides. So if a low-carb diet with plenty of natural fat raises HDL and lowers triglycerides, wouldn’t that make it a good diet? Naaaaww, can’t be … all that fat!
I eat at least three eggs a day. Cholesterol (HDL and LDL are within normal limits. My triglycerides were a bit high, due to uncontrolled diabetes.
The doctor mentioned the possibility of statins, and counseled me for the low cholesterol low fat diet.
The best part? 1 slice of bread = 3 sugar cubes. Talk about abstract. No thank you. I prefer to keep my dose low, and give my pancreas a rest.
The main problem about fiber is what type it is. If it is a starch, it will raise my blood sugar, which in the long run will do a ton of damage, not to mention impair my ability to make insulin. Then I guess I will need more insulin, and the cycle will continue.
For me, a smile and nod, swallow the usual “advice”, and continue to do what I do best. I eat to my meter. I can almost tell right now what an item will do to me right after eating. That level of control is the best.
Celery? Careful Tom, those celery farmers are a rowdy lot, you don’t want to get on the bad side of them. I ask you to be careful, because noone should be forcefed ants on a log!
If I’m found dead with a mouthful of celery stalks, you know what happened. Be well, Jason, and keep me posted on your progress.
Hope you’ve heard the good news! Subway is now offering breakfast. As if they haven’t done enough damage, now they’re offering low-fat egg-white muffins. http://www.subwayfreshbuzz.com/menu/breakfast/index.asp
Yup, I saw that. I’ll go to McDonald’s for Sausage McMuffins and toss the muffins.
Oh, I don’t mind celery being the “bad guy” and I also think that celery is the most dangerous vegetable on earth…
I HATE CELERY.
So please start your campaign immediately.
Free us from celery!
I’m on it. Celery free by 2023!
Congress must Do Something about eggs! Those evil, evil eggs contain trace amounts of nearly every vitamin and mineral the human body needs. We can’t let people go around eating them willy nilly though, they have cholesterol in them. Oh the humanity!
Best not give this Congress any ideas …
Ha, brilliant.
My theory is that every type of food is bad for you in some context. It’s just a matter of finding the ones that we get enough benefit from to make it worthwhile. (I’d put eggs and celery high on that list.) We humans just don’t seem to understand this paradox, even though it runs through a lot of different parts of our life. As a (gruesome) example, males who are castrated live longer than other men… even though it’s obviously not a great overall longevity strategy. I see the anti-(insert any food here that people have been eating for longer than 10,000 years) movement as being like someone promoting castration as a great way to live longer. Maybe a great idea if you have tunnel vision, but pretty worthless when you look at the big picture.
What about men who are just natural wimps? Do they live longer?
I saw a story on MSNBC about the new JAMA-published report linking sugar consumption to heart disease. Of course, the reporter had to talk about how we’ve “known for forty years that fat causes heart disease,” and now sugar is a culprit…but not the sugar in fruit, just added table sugar! So, just leave the syrup off your pancakes, I guess, and load up on the hash browns?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/36675974#36675974
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. So now they admit sugar lowers HDL and raises triglycerides. So if a low-carb diet with plenty of natural fat raises HDL and lowers triglycerides, wouldn’t that make it a good diet? Naaaaww, can’t be … all that fat!
Oh, I don’t mind celery being the “bad guy” and I also think that celery is the most dangerous vegetable on earth…
I HATE CELERY.
So please start your campaign immediately.
Free us from celery!
I’m on it. Celery free by 2023!
Actually I’ve noticed this trend when I try to explain about how fat is good and carbs is bad. Its not easy but still possible to convince others carbs is bad and make people believe it. But it is very hard to make people believe Fat is good. I think its something to do with this weird human instinct to believe or accept facts that tell them something is bad but its harder or in some cases impossible for them to accept something they once considered was bad is good. Also the added media influence that constantly pushes the idea of fat is bad kind of strengthens that idea in peoples head. Like I think this applies to the general human nature especially with closed minded people or people who aren’t natural sceptics. Like just a random example when the Michael Jackson trial had started, even before the jury selection, the media had jumped on this idea that MJ is a pedo and bombarded the media with so much negative press on MJ that even after he was proven innocent I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t have changed people’s perception about him much. I was quite open minded and my perception or instinct still wasn’t sure about him after that trial.
I’ve noticed that as well. Some people seem to be hard-wired to find bad news attractive. I think we’ve also been trained to believe that anything we find physically pleasurable is ultimately bad in some way … so sure, tell people the carbs they enjoy so much are bad for them, it fits the mindset. But try telling them all that delicious saturated fat is good for them, it goes against the mindset.
THANK you Phil! I thought I had read it in an Eades post, but I’ve become such a frantic reader of all things Eades, Nikoley, Naughton, Keith, Moore, Ravnskov etc. etc. etc. I can’t always get back to the source FAST enough when I dash off a comment. The books and journal articles I’ve read since Taubes (f. June 16, 2008) are arm loads. I have been on such a searching, happy mission investigating all things nutrition, well, more than ever before. I do feel like my memory is better on a high ANIMAL fat diet, but I get so excited about these blog posts and comments, I don’t take the time to stop and find the source! So I thank you again.
I have trouble with sugar and starch of course, but my biggest problem was/is with grains and wheat. I was never a vegetarian, but I do like celery and broccoli (formerly known to me as broom food). But I look at vegetables very differently now and just as I have COMPLETELY lost my desire for sweets, bread, anything processed and all the deadly (to me at least) ‘food’ I used to eat, I almost never even want many vegetables any more. Now this is what I eat- BRAIN and HEART healthy animal FAT and protein, EGGS, fish, shellfish (ya’ MUST read ‘Survival of the Fattest’ and ‘The Other Brain’), some nuts and sometimes celery. If I never eat wheat again, it will be too soon.
There are plenty of hits on a quick Google search showing how celery is a superfood for male sex drive.
Even Arthur De Vany seems to be promoting it…
http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/diet_and_fitness/article4523487.ece?token=null&offset=48&page=5
Perhaps the heart attacks are connected with…the extra exertion? 😉
Hmmm … I can’t help thinking “Is that a celery stick, or are you just happy to see me?”
Actually I’ve noticed this trend when I try to explain about how fat is good and carbs is bad. Its not easy but still possible to convince others carbs is bad and make people believe it. But it is very hard to make people believe Fat is good. I think its something to do with this weird human instinct to believe or accept facts that tell them something is bad but its harder or in some cases impossible for them to accept something they once considered was bad is good. Also the added media influence that constantly pushes the idea of fat is bad kind of strengthens that idea in peoples head. Like I think this applies to the general human nature especially with closed minded people or people who aren’t natural sceptics. Like just a random example when the Michael Jackson trial had started, even before the jury selection, the media had jumped on this idea that MJ is a pedo and bombarded the media with so much negative press on MJ that even after he was proven innocent I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t have changed people’s perception about him much. I was quite open minded and my perception or instinct still wasn’t sure about him after that trial.
I’ve noticed that as well. Some people seem to be hard-wired to find bad news attractive. I think we’ve also been trained to believe that anything we find physically pleasurable is ultimately bad in some way … so sure, tell people the carbs they enjoy so much are bad for them, it fits the mindset. But try telling them all that delicious saturated fat is good for them, it goes against the mindset.
THANK you Phil! I thought I had read it in an Eades post, but I’ve become such a frantic reader of all things Eades, Nikoley, Naughton, Keith, Moore, Ravnskov etc. etc. etc. I can’t always get back to the source FAST enough when I dash off a comment. The books and journal articles I’ve read since Taubes (f. June 16, 2008) are arm loads. I have been on such a searching, happy mission investigating all things nutrition, well, more than ever before. I do feel like my memory is better on a high ANIMAL fat diet, but I get so excited about these blog posts and comments, I don’t take the time to stop and find the source! So I thank you again.
I have trouble with sugar and starch of course, but my biggest problem was/is with grains and wheat. I was never a vegetarian, but I do like celery and broccoli (formerly known to me as broom food). But I look at vegetables very differently now and just as I have COMPLETELY lost my desire for sweets, bread, anything processed and all the deadly (to me at least) ‘food’ I used to eat, I almost never even want many vegetables any more. Now this is what I eat- BRAIN and HEART healthy animal FAT and protein, EGGS, fish, shellfish (ya’ MUST read ‘Survival of the Fattest’ and ‘The Other Brain’), some nuts and sometimes celery. If I never eat wheat again, it will be too soon.
There are plenty of hits on a quick Google search showing how celery is a superfood for male sex drive.
Even Arthur De Vany seems to be promoting it…
http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/diet_and_fitness/article4523487.ece?token=null&offset=48&page=5
Perhaps the heart attacks are connected with…the extra exertion? 😉
Hmmm … I can’t help thinking “Is that a celery stick, or are you just happy to see me?”